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Re-posting the CC thread for comments
Removing the original posting, keeping most of the comments (except the ones referring to RSC).
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on Friday, May 13th, 2011 at 12:00 pm and is filed under North Coast News.
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76 Responses to “Re-posting the CC thread for comments”
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Do we get to count the 17 on the other post too? Huh Tom?
You notice the places he mentioned serve free coffee anyway don’t they?
Thanks, Lorraine ~ I read the post you mentioned on the Wiki site. I still don’t have a clue, but (much to my relief) I don’t think I am guilty of ‘pinging’. Big load off of my shoulders. Gosh, I’ve been accused of a lot of things in my life (a few totally untrue), but I have never been accused of pinging. And, you are so right ~ it has been a great blog. (Twenty-five more hits and we all get COFFEE!) YaHoo!
Don’t feel bad, can’t tell you how many times I’ve been up for moderation and sent to the sand box LOL
Babblyn, not sure what the pinging reference to you is about, but maybe this link will answer your question: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ping_(blogging)
Oh goodie, it’s back and I re-read every single post LOL! It’s still really good back and forth on everyones part…and really interesting reading. Almost as good as one of my books.
Yep, I agree CAC, it would have been nice to know exactly what the case before the court was about. However, it wouldn’t have made much difference to everyone expressing their opinions here, this is the court of public opinion…and boy do we all have one!
I stated at the begining of all this discussion: “It would have been nice to know what the question or issue was before the judge. Reopen what case? The BK for the OSCC?” That would have told us the whole story as was previously posted. Then it makes sense. Maybe the NCN will better clarify statements made in the future to avoid confusion and questions.
All the rest is just people guessing and then complaining about what people should have known when they bought by reading the documents presented at closing. I know people have stated that they did not read them when they signed for your property. However, I thank anyone for bringing a cause of action forward to show others where they stand under the laws of Washington. It has been an interesting display of law in action. People will note that I did not say justice. Law and justice have nothing to do with each other.
Ah-oh ~ Looks like I was one who did the dirty deed, as I am up for moderation. I am so sorry! Also, (excuse my ignorance) please educate me on what ‘pinging’ is. I have no clue! I don’t want to be guilty of ‘pinging’. (Is there a lien for pinging?) Glad to see the re-post.
I can’t believe what I’m reading. I’ve been trying to talk by husband into retiring at OS, how nice it will be to escape the madness of city life. Geez, such bad feelings about something that was part of the paperwork when the purchase was made. Didn’t anybody question “community club” and what it meant? I did. Yeah, we don’t use it but some day we might. I’m more concerned about the fact that this is still such a hot topic years after the decision to charge the fees were set. Oh, we’ve owned property at OS since 1998. Not too sure we will be retiring at OS any time soon.
Nice!!
OUCH!
Not to get off the subject, but does anyone know which one of our city officials gave ‘condolences’ to our new city councilwoman the other evening? I was watching it on TV and altho I heard her given ‘condolences’, I could not tell who actually said it.
Well, the swamp was lit up for awhile……….
READ THE LAWSUIT AND DECISION!!
The board couldn’t change it if they wanted to……
The CC board tried to force RSC to sign a loyalty oath. His integrity rejected such unamerican gestapo tactics. He refused to sign. The old boys wanted him only as a lackey not as a free board member representing his constituents. There are no opponets in the upcoming board election this year, none last year and in prceeding years. No one should vote in a no opponent election where the candidates are picked for you. Don’t vote in this rigged CC election. It is pointless, useless. It only only creates a facade that the CC is in any way fair or democratic. It is also a complete waste of time.
Babblynn certainly is not peeved…not even royally. Again, I have learned a lot during this blogging event. I appreciate all of the comments and I take this as a grand opportunity to expand my knowledge. I think you folks (well, most of you) are reasonable, intelligent, generous and kind people. I read that in your comments. I have an opinion, as all of you do. I am not squeamish about sharing my opinions, and I respect ALL of you for sharing your thoughts and opinions with me. (Hell, we should grab Crabber and all go for a drink!) I find this type of dialouge informative, entertaining and refreshing. I thank Tom from Atlantis for giving us this forum. I am grateful that people choose to use it. You guys all feel like family! (Gosh, actually better than family.) I know I lean towards sarcasm, but we all tend to rely on our strengths. I enjoy reading all of your remarks. No reason to get mad here.
Now, does anyone know where the heck Crabber is? Perhaps HE got mad and won’t come back.
Maybe they will have a Tea Party at the Community Club as one of their various events!
If this blog goes to 100 comments, I think my monitor will burn out. Nice one Lorraine.
Alright, the sun has come out for a few minutes so let’s all be positive and stop griping about the CC, especially from people who do not know of what they speak.
Sorry for royally p-ing off Bablynn. I did read the entire blog. And the 10 more since last night. I use the shower down there all the time. After using the pool, the gym, the work out room. I too think it is a really good deal, and get my $12.08 out of it every month. It would a great place to take your grandkids when they come to visit on a rainy day as there is not much else to do that doesn’t cost a lot of money. And the playgrounds are very nice too. I guess I just don’t see your side when you say “extortion” as this doesn’t meet the definition. And I would have been very upset if the previous owners of my house had opted out, I probably would have bought another house. I guess if we are going to be upset about paying for things we don’t use, I could start ranting that I am paying SS into a system that will be bankrupt by the time I am old enough to collect it!
I knew about the dues when I purchased and quite frankly was excited about it. I think the price is worth the admission to the 2 outdoor pools alone from memorial Day to labor day.
Lorraine,
Your post is one of the few lights in the swamp.
Hmmmm, well, sometimes I think it might be the perceptions of the person reading the blog, maybe? I mean…I thought I worded my comment about education and paying for it in a positive way, I even went back and re-read it myself to be sure…but someone seems to have taken it in a negative manner…so I re-iterate: I have voted FOR ( in favor of ) many school levies in the past and no doubt will in the future, because I strongly believe that even though my husband and I chose not to have children, we owe to it all children to support that valuable obligation and do not take the responsibility lightly! After all, we both benefitted personally from the public education system, neither of us coming from families who could afford private schools.
Also, I am with those that believe, 1: That the CC is a worthwhile expense, 2: That there are many communities with these so called conveniences built in to the expense of owning homes in those self-same communities, and if you choose to purchase there, you make that purchase knowing the obligation exists. (Sorry, about those that didn’t, but I think it’s your job to make yourself aware.)
There are many things in life that might not be pleasant or that we might not agree with…does anyone here really ENJOY paying your Federal or State or County or City Taxes? Well, we already had a tea party more than 200 years ago, and look how far that got us LOL
You don’t want me for a leader. I like the CC and think it’s a bargain.
My point in responding is that I’m getting fairly sick and tired of all the complainers that don’t seem to want to do anything except gripe about just how bad it is here.
I often hear from people from “outside” that read the comments here and remark on how miserable our lives must be as all they know about Ocean Shores is the negativity they get from this blog.
Lead the way, Fixed-Income. What’s the plan?
Tom ~ What is the record for the number of responses on any of these threads?
If we get to 100 comments, free coffee for everyone! (Locations: IGA, ACE hardware, Flying Cats . . .)
Why do I get the feeling that the complainers about the CC fees really don’t want to do anything about it? (If it went away they would have to find something else to gripe about.)
Or do they expect someone else to fix it for them without any effort on their part?
I have lived here just 6 yrs and never once used that stupid club. when I bought my house it was not disclosed that the community club nazis could put a lien on my house or that membership was not optional. The place is run down, stinks, and has no value to me, yet I am forced to pay for a few to use it. Additionally, I found out that when you buy your house you get charged $154 to transfer the ownership of your “membership” and for them to fill in the blanks on 1 piece of paper that goes to the escrow company. Sounds like theft to me.
You should be given a chance to opt out when you purchase a house. If you don’t opt out at escrow you’re stuck!
“Does that single factor make it just fine and dandy for extortion purposes? Perhaps you should go back and read the ENTIRE blog here.”
Maybe you should go back and read everything in the blog and start applying all your efforts and arguments where they might do some good. Start with the bankruptcy court that mandated the fee in the first place.
We’ve heard that tired, old, worn out and ridiculous LECTURE before, Milly. I don’t drink lattes, nor do I eat at McDs or spend money on the lottery. NOR, do I use YOUR private club. No, I am not going to trot down to take a public shower in a private place. Gosh, how convenient would that be!?! (Do you, HONESTLY, Milly…do you take a shower there twice a week?) Yes, I KNOW I bought and agreed. I KNOW, I KNOW, I KNOW ALREADY! So what? SO WHAT? Does that single factor make it just fine and dandy for extortion purposes? Perhaps you should go back and read the ENTIRE blog here. Interesting that this “here we go again” subject now has 54 hits. Oh yeah…I guess I could put $12.08 in MY piggy bank every month toward an education for MY grandchildren.
Yes, I miss Crabber, too! He would no doubt use 289 language that would get him kicked out again, but he is a hoot! Have a good day, everybody!
Seriously? We’re going to do this again? So, we all agreed to buy here. That meant that we agreed to many terms when we did so. Part of that is the community club. Just because you choose not to use it does not mean you do not need to pay for it. That was part of the deal when you bought your place. Just like you had the right to choose your house, you had the right to choose where your house was located. If you can’t afford the requirements to live in this city, then don’t. Or sell your house and rent from someone else and then you won’t have to pay it.
When you break it down, it costs $12.08 a month. That is 3 lattes, or 2 combo meals at McD’s, a dozen scratch tickets… etc. If most of us dumped out our spare change at the end of the month, we would likely have that amount. If paying for it is a problem, try rolling your spare change each month and get some satisfaction about lugging 50 pounds of spare change down there once a year.
OR… Take advantage of it. Water here is very expensive as we all know. Take a very, very long, and very, very HOT shower down there a couple of times a week and it will MORE than pay for itself with the money you are saving at home! Time to make lemonade out of those lemons, people!
Oh, and to the people who mentioned paying for education, someone paid for yours, now it’s your turn. They are the future of our nation, people! Looking at how things are going at the moment, is this really some place you want to scrimp???
So Ref – since as Lorraine T has indicated that once again it seems we have blogged this subject to a new record and you’ve decided to bend back the “rules”, could we all have a gesture of good will and allow the CRABBER” back into the fold for good behavior and time served? I’ve missed his wit and insight, particularly on this subject. I suspect others have as well.
im bowing out of this whole thing. weither you use the ems, library or schools, they are something EVERY community needs….and one day you WILL use one of more of these services!
just seems to me that a community who WANTS something like the cc should have more of a say so in it, not some rich fats cats lookin to make money!
in my humble opinion
Waa Hoo Par tay!
As people seem to be having so much fun exchanging information/opinions, I am suspending enforcement of my regulations (no back-and-forth, no multiple commenting, etc.). Have fun, please don’t be too lengthy and/or obnoxious and enjoy this “Virtual Club.”
Signed, The Ref
@Cactus Jim, the city issues can’t be solved by emotions. Therefore there is nothing to be gained without the emotions. In November, if not sooner, new levies will be suggested to pay the debt and supplement the 2012 budget. Then in 2012 the EMS and Library Levy dance will begin with the same fervor, passion and emotion without any basis in facts. All will be normal in Ocean Shores. People will decide to either pay more or not pay more to the city. Will you get more. Don’t bet on it. You will get less for more. Sounds sort of like filling your gas tank. Both are explosive and both only take you so far.
Now I know why Ocean Shores is in so much trouble and the residents do nothing about it. All you have to do is read the comments.
@Lorraine T. Watch out in Florida! I am dealing with those issues too for my father and wife. Many of the new developments are “planned developments”. Some may even be failing because of the economy down there. However, they all still have the rules and convents attached to the titles. Every place has an admission fee and contract that varies from place to place. Places like the Villages down there are just like here with “community” pools, medical care, and a whole host of features that are in addition to the local public services. Each contract says what you get now, in the future, and even after death. People have to take personal responsibility for what they sign for. It is as simple as that. If you made the choice to buy a lot that was in the community club then you bought the cow as they say. It comes with all the BS, flies, and requirements to feed.
Wow, I think this has to be a record…or darn close to it. Thank you everyone for the comments, fascinating reading I agree with the others that have said that.
I’m with the people who knew, before buying, and at the time it really had no impact on our decision over which lot to buy. We finally came down to a choice between two, and I don’t remember whether or not the losing lot was in the CC or not…it didn’t even make it on to our pros and cons list! The lot we chose was not in the CC, and of course they sent us those pretty brocheres after we purchased, which I filed for future reference. At the time I was paying $94 per month for a joint membership in the YMCA here in Auburn, so it seemed like a good deal to me LOL, and we fully planned on joining when we retire over there. Cheaper and closer than the Y for sure! I agree with Ricki’s husband though, it would be something I would now think about a great deal as a factor for resale, but I still don’t think in my situation that I would really give that much weight, each has to decide that for themselves. I’ve paid and voted for school levies all my adult life without any regard to the fact that we had no children, I guess I figured I benefitted from public education and that was enough.
Thank you CAC for once again, clarifying some of the facts that I have been thinking about while reading these posts. One of the other places we have looked into as a retirement home, is central Florida. There are MANY developements there with HOA fees. With assorted amounts, and responsibilities in each one. These are HOUSES, not condos people…but they still are developed with a certain amount of restrictions and fees as a legal part of purchase. I guess it depends on what you want, and each person is responsible for discovering what those obligations are, and what their personal acceptance level is before they sign. I completely agree Babblyn, you make the choice based on the greatest level of comfort, knowing not everything will be perfect.
Okay Tom, edit me for length
CAC, I don’t find it strange that people complain about the $145. I’d rather decide where my $145 goes. Given a choice, I’d rather it went to the food bank. For some people, they might need that money for thier own pantry.
i dont think its so much the money as much as being forced to pay it for something that isnt a neccessity for everyone.
as a resident of north beach, my family and i have used the ems services from an ambulance to going to the fire station both old and new with the abcense of a close hospital or urgent care clinic. however, im raising boys here and we all know how much trouble boys can get into. cuts and sprains that just cant wait until the next day until we can get into our doctors but maybe not quit enough for a trip to the er.
my family and i use the library. weither it be for the internet or several other of the many services they provide. so do alot of the retired and low income families, who, weither we want to deny it or not, make up a a large portion of this community. the community cub is obviously run much like ocean shores. by a special interest group looking to make money off of these residents. seriously, i think if this town was truely put in the hands of the people of ocean shores to honestly represent what we want and need here, our voices and concerns to be taken into account when decissions are made, we would all be alot better off.
sad fact is, its run by WAY to many special interest groups and indivduals with more money than they know what to do with and they are using their riches to line the pockets of those in the communtiy to get their way. thats not what this town needs! we need a city government run by people for the people of ocean shores….bottom line!
I find it strange that people will complain about $145 dollars when the city spends almost 10 times that amount. Do you all use every “service” the city offers? Did you like the Ambulance Utility when you voted no on the EMS levy? No. DId you like the Road LID bill? No. Are you kids getting a quality educaton? Not according to the test scores and recent reviews. Will you like the bill for the run up of debt that you will have to pay soon? No. Have you thought about disolving the city? Oh, @Tony, you may want to look up Mello-Roos. I know you are quite worldly, but they are an example of “citywide” covenants. Have you ever lived in New York State? Many Villages there have similar covenants that support their PRIVATE Community Clubs. As to planned community, Ocean Shores was a “planned community” before it was a city. That is what developers call them. It had platted lots, roads, facilities, parks, and even stables on the plan. The fact that everything did not happen as “planned” does not make it any less of a “planned community”. However, the plan here went astray and still is astray.
@Rainy. I am neither for or against the community club. In fact, when I first moved here there was a movement against it and that prompted some of us to seek changes from within. Those changes happened and since some have disappeared. There were “cards” that allowed property owners free access for guests etc. Those went away I was told because no one used them. There were changes in the age limits and also residents in homes, caretakers, and other provisions. So there was an effort to change things internally. Maybe more of that needs to happen. I just pointed out that I knew about it when I bought and accepted it.
I did not know about the Carrillo Lawsuit. The increase in water rates to pay it has always bothered me. The people who should have paid that were the ones that benefited from lower water rates. They should not have gotten a refund too. Many probably would not know about the Banks Lawsuit either. It is one of the best kept secrets here. Little has been said about it over the years. However, it represents a downside of 13 million vs. 5 million dollars.
It is fine to vent about “not liking it” and thinking it “unfair”, but many things in life are unfair and not liked. By the way, we are a society of laws. The laws determine if things are right or wrong at that period of time. If you don’t like what the Court did, then change the law. Then you can have your day in court to overturn what you feel is not right.
I do wish that all the folks that are so good at carping about the “unfairness” of the CC fees would get off their backsides, organize, raise some money to retain a lawyer and bring suit in the bankruptcy court that mandated it. Any change will have to be through the court, not the by-laws as it was the court that ordered it in the first place. The club is under the same rule and couldn’t change it without the courts permission even if they wanted to.
I’m sure that RSC would happily be your leader. (Although it appears that he went up against said court and lost, so maybe not.)
Can’t argue with that, Mark. I am guilty. I don’t know if I lived here then or not, but I have definitely been lame at paying attention to things like that at the CC. The only thing I read in their newspaper is the ‘New Victims List’. You have a very solid point, Mark. I never consider myself a member of the club. I guess I should when it comes to the voting end of things. Not that it would do any good, but I will pay attention from now on. I also want to thank everyone who has contributed to this thread, no matter your personal opinion. I have certainly learned a lot from ALL of your comments.
No one seems to favor the CC mandatory dues, but how many spoke up several years ago when the CC board of directors issued and had approved by members, the massive change in the by-laws that all members voted on?
It looks like CAC is on the wrong side of this one. The CC is inept at providing anything extorted people could value. CC just throws hubris and arrogance into the extortion fires. It would have been better to let RSC democratically run for office and let nature take its course. The CC was too chicken to let him run and that is more guilt they must carry. Their back will break someday with all the animosity and hatred they create. Democracy needs to set the course. A fascist organization rarely outlives its promoters who profit when the organization extorts others. Those promoters are getting old. Who will survive, extorters or extortees?
Exactly what I was thinking Babblynn!!! Thank you for saying it so well!
Babblynn, you are right on target.
Thirty-four responses so far. (Hmmm…yeah, it certainly is an old, tired and DEAD issue.) Tom posts city financial facts and issues, that do not get this much attention. Mistakes have been made in the city finances and can be dealt with, with common sense. The city’s financial picture is fixable. The required dues for the CC is, indeed, extortion. (Thank you, anonymous…great word! I always write ‘begrudgingly’ on my checks.) It is just plain wrong. WRONG. Yes, CAC, I knew and I signed anyway. I wanted to live here. I love living here. However, because I knew and because I signed and because I wanted to and because I love it, DOES NOT MAKE THE REQUIRED DUES RIGHT. That is not a justification for ’suckin’ it up. It’s wrong. WRONG. You can expound all you want on the by-laws, the in-laws and the out-laws. IT IS STILL WRONG. VERY, VERY WRONG.
Not everyone with property within the city of Ocean Shores joins the Community Club. When I purchased and moved here, I was specifically told that my property was not in the Community Club and that I would have to contact them if I wanted to join. The local real estate agent and their receptionist pushed me really hard to join, but I never did. I still have all of the wonderful glossy literature the Community Club sent me along with an invitation, but something about once being in, you can’t get out again really bothered me. I am so glad I didn’t join now. Ocean Shores is wonderful and doesn’t really need a Community Club, there’s already tons of stuff to see and do. BTW, thank you to everyone who has posted something about this, the education you have provided is invaluable.
Tony, you do not want to get into this, trust me.
Hmmmm… I’ve live many places in my time and I’ve never seen a covenant that covered an ENTIRE city.
As for the attitude of “If you don’t like it, go live somewhere else.” Ocean Shores is a CITY, not a planned community nor a condo association. I live here, because my job is here.
Comparing paying your taxes for Fire, Police, or Schools and paying dues to a PRIVATE club are apples and oranges. These are the public services that, as a society, we have chosen to do.
What PUBLIC service or good does the Community Club provide? It does some things for it’s private members, but I know of NO PUBLIC service the club provides.
I go back to my original point, the dues for the Community Club are an ILLEGAL tax.
AMEN!!!
And literally much, much saner too, I meant to say.
I’ve also often thought that Mr. Stermer-Cox would be much happier if he wasn’t in Ocean Shores. At some point it’s much healthier to realize that the wall you’ve been banging your head against will only move on its own time, not yours. While it is a fine place for some, I know I personally am much happier for leaving the incessant negative noise of that place, understandable as it is, behind.
@ QW EWrty, Thanks for your comments. Awhile back, I could have allowed this issue to really stir me up, and rightfully so as this is the ONLY situation of it’s kind that I had every heard of or been subject to. Its way to late to try to go back on the realitor that sold us on this place, that person is long gone themselves. Now, in the scheme of things, I’ve become like everyone else and just put up with it. I could say alot more on this, but I’d just get kicked to the sandboxblog and that is probably were this whole discussion should/will wind up anyway.
@Q.W.Erty, I think you have hit it on the head. It is a sore that people keep scratching. However, everyone knew when they bought the property that they had the sore. Since I was limited by the rules as to length, one can go to http://law.justia.com/cases/federal/appellate-courts/F2/944/909/34519/ to see the history and record on the Bankruptcy.
Green Bean, the answers to your questions are a bit complicated. But in a nutshell, if memory serves … Facing a tough lawsuit over the membership issue, the club chose to declare bankruptcy thus kicking the issue up into federal bankruptcy court. This was in the late 80s and into the early 90s, I believe. Essentially the bankruptcy court, which sits on the right hand of god where power is concerned, ordered the club to offer members a one-time only opt-out option. Ballots were mailed to all property owners and I do think it’s fair to say it was a classicly complicated ballot that confused many people who may have voted contrary to their intent. One of the upshots out of the whole issue, as I understand it, is that the club operates, at least in terms of the membership scheme, under federal court order making challenges difficult and expensive. I believe it was the federal court decision that gave them additional clout in court when it comes to foreclosure powers. I’m not up on the latest developments, or the stermer-cox case, but all the answers to your questions are somewhere in the archives of the north coast news.
Yes, caveat emptor certainly does apply when it comes to the club, and yes, I agree, you have to just suck it up or sell if you don’t like it but really, at the end of the day, the situation with the club, its mandatory membership, right of foreclosure, and aggressive pursuit of people seemingly with no quarter and no remorse, is not a net positive for the community of ocean shores. I think all the rancor it creates is quite unfortunate really and just icing on top of the fact that the city has never really been a sustainable community. This in essence is where the majority of issues in the city stem. In my opinion, of course.
@CAC – I aggree with Iverson that this IS old news, but one thing I have never quite understood was, Why was there only a one time opt out period? when did this happen?(year). How long did it last? A day, week, six months? What were the circumstances for having an opt out period? Why didn’t more people opt out back in the day, And, most importantly, (to put this thing back in the closet of news worthy items), why was there only one opt out period and there have been none since?
I have resigned myself to this misunderstood covenant that I signed when I chose to move here and it is a battle I just don’t see as ever going away, unless some clever attorney moves here and decides to take the case on for him/herself. None the less, I’d still like to know the answers to the above questions.
@Cutie. You might want to learn about Ocean Shores before you speak of “Generations”. The cows left and they built the Community Club and the development here. The original members got special memberships. The rest were given the option to opt out during the bankruptcy. So, if you were not the “original founding property owners” or one who selected to opt out you pay. You pay because it is part of the title of the land. You pay because you choose to live in the city on a lot that was part of the community club. You could have chosen to live in Hogan’s Corner outside the city or on one of the many lots that are not in the community club after the bankruptcy. If you did not make those choices you have chosen to pay because you signed on the dotted line. Choice is how the world does work.
Moreover, the PRIVATE Club is not required to serve the whole community. That is why it is private. Those that pay for it use it. If it was a PUBLIC Club it would then be open to everyone in the community to use. There is a difference. You live on PRIVATE PROPERTY. That means that the PUBLIC can not come to your house and use your toilet, food, backyard, and BBQ. If you want PUBLIC toilets, food, backyards and BBQs you can go to the North Bay Park which is a PUBLIC facility for the world to use.
I, personally, don’t appreciate having to pay those dues when we never use the community club. I also find it interesting that a huge part of their budget is spent on a retainer for an attorney to defend themselves. When I have to write that check once a year, I indicate “extortion” on the “for” line at the bottom of my check.
The community club dues were part of the criteria that was required when you bought your property. No one forced you to buy property and live here. If your realtor mis-represented the situation when you bought, you should be going after your realtor. If all the complainers would unite and petition to change the by-laws, you could probably do something, but it seems that in this community, there is a lot of complainers but no do-ers. Get active or live with it or sell and move.
my point is about the familes, generations living here and having to pay into it and not use it. this isnt all about just those who bought a house here in shores but ones who were forced into paying it when the club opened.
alot of familes here are on fixed incomes, have been for years and are forced into paying for something that serves them no purpose. these are the ones who use the ems, and their childerns children use the library and schools. generations that have lived here and just flat out can barely afford to keep their homes let alone pay for a private club that doesnt serve the community as a whole. this is what angers me the most.
forget for one second its in the ‘rules’ when you buy a home in shores, as wrong as some of us might think it is. what about those who depend on state aid to live, food banks in the community to eat, is it fair to them when they bought their homes long before the ‘community club’ was ever built? thats my point!
Oh, CAC ~ Your logic and precise reasoning has won me over. You are totally correct. I am at fault here. I certainly have no right to complain or voice a negative opinion in this matter. I now believe that the concept used to financially back the Community Club is extremely sound and just. I will now look forward to writing my next membership checks with glee and joy, supported by the knowledge that I was dead wrong about the entire matter. Thank you for allowing me to see the error of my ways.
@Babblynn. I don’t use the club. However, I knew it existed when I bought because I read the documents presented before closing. It is just like buying a condo and knowing there are association fees for the common areas. You may not use the gym, rec room, pool, or select the flowers around the BBQ area, but you know that you are going to pay for it. It just is part of the package. This old story has two solutionis. Don’t buy where these type of organizations exist or move out if it does not suit your taste or wallet. No one put a gun to anyone’s head to buy here. No one put a gun to anyone’s head to buy the second lot. No one is at fault other than the the people who are complaining here. You signed on the dotted line and bought what you own.
CAC must ENJOY his PRIVATE CLUB a lot. I guess I should be HAPPY that I can HELP HIM enjoy it. Personally, I would RATHER pay MY $290 in TAXES.
If one reads their title report it clearly states that the Community Club exists and holds a lien. It also clearly states that you had to get them to take second position if you got a mortgage. In fact, that payment shows on your HUD Report. One does not need to be told things. One has a duty to read the documents they are presented with.
The OSCC is a PRIVATE CLUB for the BENEFIT of THE MEMBERS which ARE THOSE LAND OWNERS THAT HAVE THE COVENANT ON THEIR TITLES. If YOU are not the LAND OWNER then YOU are not a MEMBER. If you RENT your LANDLORD is the MEMBER. If YOU PAY for MEMBERSHIP as a RENTER you can USE the facility.
SINCE THIS IS A PRIVATE ENTITY it is NOT A TAX. TAXES are paid to GOVERNMENT. The Parks and Recreation Dept of Ocean Shores offers summer events for kids. During the rest of the year there are activities at the the schools such as sports.
To absorb it into the City Parks and Rec system one would have to PAY FOR THE LAND AND FACILITES. Ocean Shores spends only limited money on parks and rec. If you want Parks and Rec in Ocean Shores you donate it. Gary is right. This is old news. It is what it is. I don’t think 145 dollars is sending anyone to the poor house. There are more important issues ahead. You right now are paying 1.75 per 1000 for the roads for the next 18 years. You are going to pay more or lose any services that touch you soon enough. We have a real debt crisis called city government. That should be your focus. This is nothing but a distraction.
@molly. doesnt matter how many properties you own, you have to pay a membership on each one, or so im told. at least my landlord does. he pays for one on his property and one for the rental house i live in.
What bothers me is if one family owns more than one piece of property in the shores, they are required to pay for more than one membership. I thought it didn’t matter how many lots one family owned as they were only required to pay for one membership. Did the policy change or is my memory faulty?
No offense, but this is such OLD NEWS. This has been griped about for many years and yet nothing changes, years ago there was a one time opportunity to opt out of the club if you so chose and several people did so. Unless something drastically changes, LIVE WITH IT!
it isnt truely a “community club” if all members of the community cant access with paid dues, bottom line! this includes anyone on the north beach! it is clearly a private club that only members of ocean shores can access once forced to pay for it weither they use it or not!
doesnt that sound just totally wrong or is it just me?
isnt that what the “community club” is all about?
i can see paying for ems services, library and such because alot of the community uses these services, alot more than the community club services! i know i have and so do alot of kids. if they didnt have the library, they could be doing worse things! since the community club is so hard for the kids to access, the library is about all they have left!
if they are going to call themselves, the ‘community club’ then they need to rethink their fess and who can access it. otherwise they are nothing more than pick pockets praying on the land owners of ocean shores!
in my humble opinion…
The $145 per home for what is equivalent to “Association Fees” or Mello Roos fees then it is a pretty good deal. It is an opportunity cost. As stated below, if the city was running the facilities it would cost you $1000 a year. Most Timeshares have fees around $500 for just one week of access. Everyone who has bought property here knows they can buy in or out of the Community Club. Everyone knows that they could put someone on title to property and own it as Tennants in Common and specify by contract the ownership portion anyone owns. That simple act would allow parents, children or anyone else have access as an owner to the Community Club. I don’t want to pay for many of the city “services” and the school system here either. However, I have to because it is a duty that comes with the land! Where one buys is a choice. You have made it as either your own home or an investment property. As an investment property it is a cost of doing business. Deduct it. When you sell the property, realize the expense and get over it.
The community club is run by a bunch of egotistical, controling thieves. We own two houses. My husband’s parents live in one. We pay TWO yearly fees. My mother and father-in-law cannot use the club unless they pay one dollar per visit. Consequently, they don’t feel welcome there and they never use the damn place. My husband and I never use the damn place. Recently ran into one of the club’s commisioners, or whatever they call themselves. I told him that we pay $300 a year for two places and our elderly parents (who live within walking distance) can’t get in without a buck. He told me that I was wrong: I am not paying $300 a year. Okay…he was right. We pay $290. Such a freakin’ bargain. They are thieves.
I pay for EMS,Library,and other services that I don’t use. I am forced to pay property taxes to run a city government that is totally disfunctional. I pay way more than I should for utilities and have no choice even though it is clear the money is grossly misspent. So what is the big deal other than some people just like to pick on stuff. If there wasn’t the club, you would be paying twice what you are for the city to run a park system. And it would only be open half time and look like Dogpatch. If you want to pick on something, go pick on why $1 million of the new water plant funds was spent on “OTHER”.
I sympathize and agree with Mr. Stermer-Cox. I’m a low income senior citizen who has always been personally responsible. I don’t want to be forced to pay for something I don’t use.
When I purchased my home I thought the club would have something for everyone and the they would be open to listening to suggestions as was indicated, Not the case!! Anything interesting to me is always an extra charge. I’ve been told if I don’t like paying, that’s tough and I should leave town.
It’s ironic that the club newspaper invites people to tell the story of why they moved to Ocean Shores. It would be more appropriate to ask why they left!!!
my kids and i live in a rental house in shores and ive offered the landlord to ‘buy out’ his membership to this house so my kids and i could use the cc since he owns and lives in a house just down the street and he doesnt have use for two memberships. that process is still in the works.
what makes more sense to me is an annual membership for those who would like to use the club, like a gym membership so everyone can use the cc and not just ocean shores residnets. something like prices for singles, couples and families. seems to me, they would make more money that way but maybe thats just me.
I agree cutie. We would pay to use the facility but since we own a house that is NOT in the CC, we can’t. And my husband (smart man) refuses to sign up for something that you can’t get out of.
playing the devils advocate here i have to say, i dont see where its right for any community, or town can put such a law into place that requires a home owner to “pay dues” on something they might not even use. ive always thought this to be a little strange.
maybe there is an issue of finacial burden on the home owner to pay the dues, is it fair they loose their house because they cant afford it? this isnt the only home owner i know who is in this position!
isnt there some other way this town can support the community club, like people who want to use it pay the dues or have a useage fee for each time someone wants to come in and use the facility? there has to be some other way!
why force a home owner to pay for something they dont use or cant afford?!