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Beach clean-up note
From Ken Lanfear: Minor correction for a couple of your bloggers: the cleanup at the Marine View beach approach is an irregular (as needed) activity of the Public Works street crew, same people and equipment as on the beach on July 5th, not LeMay as given credit by the bloggers. Also, if there is illegal dumping that can be tracked (we check the “dumping”) it is turned over to the Police; however, much of what is collected here is from ‘volunteers’ picking on the beach and in the dunes, and is an activity that we support.
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Any system will be abused. People now are especially prone to that mindset. However, that does not mean that you have to stop trying to reduce the abuse. We have technology now that allows us to video record these activities and then cite them. People act differently when they know they are being watched. People leave all kinds of stuff on trails. That is true everywhere. Disposable diapers are the worst invention yet. Maybe we should give community service clean up of the beach as our court system fines instead of money. Bring back the chain gangs.
I know it seems like a good idea to charge everyone for trash pickup, but I’m pretty sure there will still be abusers. I live in a city that requires trash pickup at every home, but still there is “illegal dumping” at every empty lot, at the end of dirt roads, anywhere that they think they can get away with it. Sorry, but I’m a bit of a cynic on this, I’ve backpacked for 30 plus years and can attest that there are illegal dumps just about everywhere.
I wondered about this issue myself CAC, thanks for the info, now I understand. I’ve seen people drive up to the dumpsters at the Chance approach and put garbage bags in them that I was pretty sure was full of household stuff, not visitors beach stuff. I know we have a spot over here called the InterUrban Trail that goes through most of the Auburn, Kent Renton Valley and the garbage cans there really get abused also, instead of used for the purpose intended.
If you want to properly dispose of trash found around the city, just take it to the Permit Center next to the Shell Station. You are supposed to get bags from them, the police station or visitor information center. However, I would say it is better picked up and put there rather than anywhere else in the city. The city does not have large bins anymore because rental units, weekenders, contractors, locals without trash pick up and DYIers abused them. Toilets and insulation are not beach trash. Until they charge everyone for the service, no matter how they use the house or campground site, will this issue go away.
As visitors, there was no place to put the trash we picked up at the Damon Pt entry to the beach. We tried to put it up out of harm’s way, but next day had to pick up again as a dog/coyote/bear had gotten into the McDonald’s wrappers again. Wish there was a BIG trashcan out there by the old restroom. Something that was critter-proof, if there is such a thing.
A big THANK YOU to those who went out on the beach for clean-up day.
You just have to do what the snowbirds currently do here. They are here in a smaller place for summer and then take that camper south to AZ or NM for the winter. I wish I could. Winter here is not that much different from summer. Just some more rain. Snow is a seldom enjoyed event that generally is gone by afternoon. Great for those pictures and then puff gone. Town is quite too. Storms are also great to watch.
Yes, life’s realities. Sounds like you and your husband have the same conversations as we do. We do camp when we can, trying to get a feel of what it would be like to full time it at OS. Unfortunately as I said before, the summer is way different than the cooler months, so we still don’t know if we want to retire there.
Yes, but….the timing of retirement and building is flexible to a certain extent. Would be nice to make a deal right now, but examining the pros and cons convinced my husband and I that it would be better to wait two more years. If we have to deal with prices going up in the meantime, such is life, we would like not to leave ourselves in a stranglehold for the remaining years of our lives. I’m sure birder sounds like the kind of person who has had to deal with the same life realities. Also, sure we could build small now, but I don’t want to live in small for the next thirty or so years….so, another reason to wait : )Patience is a virtue. Of course, I’m not camping on my property in the meantime darnit, but I don’t begrudge others from enjoying their property that way. Would I want to live next door to them, sure, as long as they respect their neighbors like I do.
Birder, a personal question I just can’t resist…does 1952 have any personal meaning? S’cuse me for being nosy.
Your going to retire with or without the recession. Contractors are making deals to keep themselves and crews working. The other costs are always going to be going up. Retirement accounts may be down now, but the markets will return. Many advisors tell you to invest even in low markets because the shares bought today will be worth more later. History has proved that.
“why not build”
In two words, the recession. With cut backs in job hours, increased medical insurance costs, increased medical costs, utility increases, gas increases. Well, you get the picture. Also, the decrease in value of principal residences as well as retirement accounts. ‘nuf said??? That is why we still camp.
Now that they are so hungry for tax dollars I think they may think otherwise because the utilities increase property value. If you have the utilities, what is the difference between a house and a trailer? The so many days on and off prevents longterm use of property by trailers. Then the city is not Division 12 everywhere. Reasonable use of property and also reasonable regulation make sense these days.
Now days I would not be surprosed if you could use your lot on those off periods as long as a neighbor did not complain. Maybe talk to them first. I have seen lots here where the trailer does not leave. They just get a new permit every 90 days. I do not know if anyone is watching the chicken coop.
We also have a whole new crop of council members. If property owners get together and start pushing for the change on the condition that all three utilities are put in or exist, then maybe they can overcome the objection. Heck, why not build. Not much difference now in costs. Manufactured homes or a small cabn are not that expensive.
I’m pretty sure you’d have to do some fast talkin’, to use the lots longer. I met one of your charming City Council Members (no sarcasm here, I mean that sincerely) while we were property shopping a couple of years ago, and from things said, I’m pretty sure that council member at the least would not be in favor of extending the time spent on bare lots. But who knows, maybe I read him/her completely wrong.
” If the city was smart, they would set up a system to allow more days over the year if you did water, sewer and electric on the lot. They could use a 90 days use and then 30 days off. Then someone would have 270 days of use that would probably correspond to the Fall/Spring Clam Digs and Summer. Winter is really not that popular.”
I totally agree. People are paying 12 months of property tax, 12 months for utilities and can only use their lots for 3 months. Granted, we knew this when we bought, but it would still be nice if we could use our property longer. (yes, we have electricity, water and sewer). Spending more time there we would be able to see if we could retire and build a permanent home. Right now we go to escape the city life, usually during the week in the summer. I would love to be able to actually live there to enjoy the less hectic times like early spring (Birding festival) and fall.
The Permit Center, Visitors Center and possibly the Police Station all have trash bags you can buy and put into the public works bin. However, the bear issue is only a recent issue. Also, they could use bear resistant trash cans. That may be something the city has to move to as the bear population grows. Adapt and survive. We as a city have to adapt to the changes in land use and also the growth here. With growth you have more neighbors and the issues that creates. If we can move people with campsites to build we improve the tax base which needs the revenue for services provided. The campsites then will slowly transition.
I like your thinking Citizen, I read where you had said that before “maybe it is time to make water and power required for the campground lots.” and at the time I thought it was just crazy, the permit for power alone is so expensive, although the water/sewer permit is very doable. To at least require the water sewer connection would seem to make a lot of sense and if it is legal to include trash pickup in that bill, it certainly would simplify matters. I have one thought about that though. We had considerered building our house before we retired to use as a get a way home in the meantime and while we were mulling over all the pros and cons, one seemed to me to be garbage pick up. If the bears love the garbage, you couldn’t exactly leave the trash out for pick up, and if you are only there on weekends, how would you handle putting out the can and taking it back in? No easy solution to that, that I can think of. When we talked to the permit office about some of the ways people use their bare lots, they mentioned the garbage program, where by people register to camp on their lots, are given bags for trash which they can drop off at the dumpster, I think (?) at the permit office, if I remember correctly…for a small fee. That was a couple of years ago, but has that changed? Or is it simply one of the things that is not getting inforced as much because of the cut backs in city personnel? I mean, most consciencious people would do things like that for many reasons, because most of us at heart are good people. Our lot is at present uncleared, covered with the lovely wax myrtle etc, like many others and the deer (a friend who was over recently reported seeing a doe and her fawn) which it will remain until we build. We don’t own an RV and have no intention of owning one in the near future, but if we did, we would have cleared, brought in water, sewer and power just to make using it easier. Birder, you are right, that is a selling point in many real estate ads, even Zillow mentions that frequently in bare land lots for sale.
Contact the owner of the rental property. Noise complaints can be handled by the Police. Other code violations are handled by the Code Enforcement Officer, Claire. If it is an illegal rental, she can deal with that. Mandatory, true mandatory, trash pick up for all properties solves most of the neighborhood trash issues. It also stops most of the illegal dumping. If it is on the water bill, there is no escaping it.
Again, maybe it is time to make water and power required for the campground lots. Greater fire safety and less noise from generators. Also, it still lets them camp 90 days a year. They may even build sooner.
If the city was smart, they would set up a system to allow more days over the year if you did water, sewer and electric on the lot. They could use a 90 days use and then 30 days off. Then someone would have 270 days of use that would probably correspond to the Fall/Spring Clam Digs and Summer. Winter is really not that popular.
“We can do without the annual invasion of diesel belching monsters and their crews of noisy drunks, kids, dogs, mountains of trash, and air polluting campfires.”
Really, do you really think that the above are attributable solely to “campers”. Sounds like a lot of over generalization. In my experience, the loudest neighbors when I visit are cabin owners or renters. What do you think would happen to Ocean Shores if you did away with the 90 day camping rule. Check out your real estate ads, notice that this rule is a selling point.
I’m afraid laws and codes are just things to be finagled around by some people. We can’t dictate other peoples consciences and there will always be those that believe it’s okay to circumvent. So, it probably won’t matter how many receptacles are placed around or how well they are maintained. Not a defeatist, just a realist. Catching people and punishing them in a meaningful way, ie: wallet, is probably the only way to make an impact. However, do we want to waste our police dept. time in this way? It’s our money ultimately, so, personally I vote for joining in with the rest who happily clean up the garbage left by those who just don’t care.
Could the city be guilty of violating their own laws?
8.04.050 Litter receptacles required where—Failure to comply—Penalty.
A. Litter receptacles shall be placed in all parks, trailer parks in respect to the service of transient habitation, gasoline service stations, tavern parking lots, shopping centers, grocery store parking lots, marinas, boat launching areas, beaches, bathing areas and other such public places in numbers appropriate to need as specified by state regulation.
B. It is the responsibility of any person owning or operating any establishment or public place in which litter receptacles are required by this section to procure and place and maintain such litter receptacles at their own expense on the premises in accord with such state regulations.
C. Any person who violates the provisions of this section by failing to place such litter receptacles on the premises in the numbers and design required by state regulations for a first offense shall be guilty of a Class C offense as defined in Section 7.01.050 of this code for a first offense, and shall be subject to a fine of ten dollars. Each day the violation continues shall be a separate offense. Any and all subsequent violations of this section within a period of one year shall be guilty of a Class B offense as defined in Section 7.01.050 of this code.
(Ord. 693 § 3, 2000; Ord. 281 § 3 (part), 1979: Ord. 108 § 4, 1973)
Ken even picked up some trash on the beach at Chance A La Mer access today. They just need some stings to pay for city trash services at the state park bathrooms and other places in town. Enforce the code:
8.04.060 Use of receptacles—Failure to comply—Penalty.
A. Persons placing litter in litter receptacles shall do so in such manner as to prevent it from being carried or deposited by the elements upon any street, sidewalk or other public place or upon any private residence or other private property.
B. Litter receptacles placed on sidewalks and other public places shall be used only for such litter material as persons may have for disposal while passing along the street or other public places such as public parks and beach approaches, and in no event shall be used for the disposal of other solid waste accumulated in residences or places of business.
C. Any person violating the provisions of this section shall be guilty of a Class C offense as defined in Section 7.01.050 of this code for a first offense, and shall be subject to a fine of two hundred fifty dollars. Each day the violation continues shall be a separate offense. Any and all subsequent violations of this section within a period of one year shall be guilty of a Class B offense as defined in Section 7.01.050 of this code.
(Ord. 693 § 4, 2000; Ord. 593 § 3, 1996; Ord. 108 § 5, 1973)
Lorraine, I’m talking about the dune line on the shore side. On your right if you are facing the ocean. And, for the most part, it is stuff that washed up on the beach.
“Maybe it is time also to require campground sites to have water and electric connections.”
Maybe it’s time to do away with camping in residential areas. This was part of the original development hype, and it might have been OK when Ocean Shores was more forest than houses, but we are a city now.
What other city allows camping on vacant lots in the middle of established neighborhoods?
We can do without the annual invasion of diesel belching monsters and their crews of noisy drunks, kids, dogs, mountains of trash, and air polluting campfires.
we go to damon point – and I really am not capable of carrying much extra out myself –
last time I was at the old big parking lot (I have to admit it was several years ago) – you know the one that you used to be able to drive to way down the sand spit – not the parking lot that was washed out a couple years ago – this one had bus parking places – there was garbage piled up neatly there – now who is going to get at that and take it out? whether or not it is still there I don’t know.
The issue regarding illegal dumping is that our City Council and Mayor have not addressed yet the current Mandatory Trash Pick Up law’s lack of teeth and cross accounting to determine who is not getting pick up from LeMay. The city has rental houses that do not have pick up. Yesterday there was an asian man picking up the cover to the trash cans at Chance A La Mer. He had a car full of trash along with another vehicle with trash in it. The two car owners said they had rented houses here and were getting rid of their trash. Perfect evidence that we need to bill on the water bills for trash. That way we charge every residence for trash. We also should be charging for trash when campers come. Instead of voluntary sign up at the Police Station, it should be at the Visitors Information Center where hours are longer and on weekends. Then we can sell the bags and get the money.
Maybe it is time also to require campground sites to have water and electric connections. That protect them from fire and reduces the noise from generators. Sewer would also be a good idea. They then could get rid of the dump site when they sell the Public Works building. It would also lead people to develop the land as vacation homes quicker. That would increase the tax base and improve services.
Thank you to the Public Works dept once again for trying to keep up with littering! However, I don’t know about anyone else, but nothing identifying goes in my garbage these days! Too much identity theft, also, wouldn’t anyone illegally dumping make sure there was nothing in it to identify them with? Unless we are talking about Crabbers “stupid people” here again : )
Not beating a dead horse here either, but the dumping I’ve seen has been about mid-way through the dunes off of the path about 20-25 feet to the north. I seriously doubt that anyone ‘voluntarily’ picking up trash on the beach, would leave it there. I admit we only make it over about once a quarter, last visit was for the Razor Clam Festival, but each time we walk that path because it is quieter down at that end of the beach, and each time we see that dump site, with fresh garbage.
Anon, are you talking about the Trail Head where people park to go out that path? Is that where you are seeing the bags/trash? Or at the dune line on the shore side?
Sorry to beat a dead horse, but I support clean up activity, too. As long as you take the trash ALL the way out, not leaving it at the dune line to blow back onto the beach! It’s an ugly eyesore.